[GENERAL SCHMIDT]20LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] Mr21NPMr .22SENT. Chief23NPChief Justice24NPJustice ,25,, and26CCand may27MDmay it28PPit please29VVplease the30DTthe Court31NPCourt :32:: In33INin a34DTa typical35JJtypical and36CCand recent37JJrecent year38NNyear ,39,, more40JJRmore than41INthan 1542CD@card@ million43CDmillion Americans44NPSAmericans became45VVDbecome victims46NNSvictim of47INof identity48NNidentity theft49NNtheft .50SENT. One-third51NNone-third of52INof those53DTthose had54VHDhave their55PP$their personal56JJpersonal information57NNinformation misused58VVNmisuse in59INin an60DTan employment61NNemployment or62CCor tax-related63JJtax-related fraud64NNfraud setting65NNsetting .66SENT. Many67JJmany of68INof those69DTthose victims70NNSvictim were71VBDbe left72VVNleave to73TOto untangle74VVuntangle reputations75NNSreputation ,76,, eligibilities77NNSeligibility ,78,, and79CCand other80JJother finances81NNSfinance .82SENT. That83DTthat is84VBZbe why85WRBwhy Kansas86NPKansas ,87,, like88INlike every89DTevery other90JJother state91NNstate ,92,, makes93VVZmake identity94NNidentity theft95NNtheft a96DTa crime97NNcrime .98SENT. Our99PP$our laws100NNSlaw apply101VVPapply in102INin all103DTall settings104NNSsetting to105TOto all106DTall people107NNSpeople ,108,, citizen109NNcitizen and110CCand alien111NNalien alike112RBalike .113SENT. Respondents114NNSrespondent were115VBDbe convicted116VVNconvict because117INbecause they118PPthey stole119VVDsteal other120JJother people121NNSpeople 's122POS's personal123JJpersonal information124NNinformation with125INwith intent126NNintent to127TOto defraud128VVdefraud .129SENT. But130CCbut ,131,, in132INin Respondents133NNSrespondent '134POS' view135NNview ,136,, these137DTthese state138NNstate criminal139JJcriminal laws140NNSlaw that141WDTthat govern142VVPgovern everybody143NNeverybody else144RBelse do145VVPdo not146RBnot apply147VVapply to148TOto them149PPthem .150SENT. They151PPthey argue152VVPargue that153IN/thatthat Congress154NPCongress has155VHZhave ,156,, in157INin effect158NNeffect ,159,, granted160VVDgrant them161PPthem special162JJspecial immunity163NNimmunity because164INbecause their165PP$their intent166NNintent was167VBDbe to168TOto obtain169VVobtain employment170NNemployment that171IN/thatthat Congress172NPCongress has173VHZhave forbidden174VVNforbid .175SENT. This176DTthis Court177NPCourt never178RBnever has179VHZhave so180RBso held181VVNhold and182CCand should183MDshould not184RBnot now185RBnow .186SENT. The187DTthe conflict188NNconflict fatal189JJfatal to190TOto the191DTthe Arizona192NPArizona employment193NNemployment statute194NNstatute is195VBZbe not196RBnot present197JJpresent here198RBhere ,199,, because200INbecause Kansas201NPKansas prohibits202VVZprohibit the203DTthe theft204NNtheft of205INof personal206JJpersonal information207NNinformation by208INby anybody209NNanybody ,210,, not211RBnot work212NNwork by213INby unauthorized214JJunauthorized aliens215NNSalien .216SENT. And217CCand this218DTthis Court219NPCourt has220VHZhave identified221VVNidentify no222DTno preempted223VVNpreempt field224NNfield relevant225JJrelevant here226RBhere .227SENT. Section228NPSection 1324a229NP1324a (230(( b231LSb )232)) (233(( 5234LS5 )235)) means236VVZmean what237WPwhat it238PPit says239VVZsay and240CCand no241RBno more242RBRmore .243SENT. The244DTthe I-9245NPI-9 verification246NNverification system247NNsystem is248VBZbe available249JJavailable only250RBonly for251INfor specified252JJspecified federal253JJfederal uses254NNSuse .255SENT. (256(( b257LSb )258)) (259(( 5260LS5 )261)) 's262POS's use263NNuse limitation264NNlimitation ,265,, which266WDTwhich is267VBZbe quite268RBquite different269JJdifferent from270INfrom typical271JJtypical preemption272NNpreemption provisions273NNSprovision ,274,, is275VBZbe one276CDone of277INof several278JJseveral safeguards279NNSsafeguard Congress280NPCongress adopted281VVDadopt in282INin to283TOto limit284VVlimit both285DTboth governments286NNSgovernment '287POS' and288CCand employers289NNSemployer '290POS' use291NNuse of292INof the293DTthe then294RBthen novel295JJnovel I-9296NPI-9 system297NNsystem .298SENT. But299CCbut traditional300JJtraditional state301NNstate criminal302JJcriminal law303NNlaw still304RBstill reaches305VVZreach misconduct306NNmisconduct elsewhere307RBelsewhere in308INin the309DTthe employment310NNemployment context311NNcontext if312INif proven313VVNprove without314INwithout use315NNuse of316INof the317DTthe I-9318NPI-9 system319NNsystem .320SENT. For321INfor example322NNexample ,323,, states324NNSstate certainly325RBcertainly still326RBstill may327MDmay prosecute328VVprosecute a329DTa felon330NNfelon who331WPwho uses332VVZuse a333DTa stolen334VVNsteal identity335NNidentity to336TOto defeat337VVdefeat a338DTa background339NNbackground check340NNcheck as341INas a342DTa condition343NNcondition of344INof employment345NNemployment at346INat a347DTa child348NNchild care349NNcare center350NNcenter ,351,, even352RBeven if353INif he354PPhe also355RBalso used356VVDuse the357DTthe same358JJsame stolen359JJstolen identity360NNidentity on361INon his362PP$his Form363NPForm I-9364NPI-9 .365SENT. So366RBso too367RBtoo with368INwith the369DTthe tax370NNtax withholding371NNwithholding forms372NNSform used373VVNuse here374RBhere .375SENT. [JUSTICE GINSBURG]376LOC[JUSTICE GINSBURG] But377CCbut is378VBZbe n't379RBn't it380PPit telling381VVGtell ,382,, General383NPGeneral Schmidt384NPSchmidt ,385,, that386WDTthat in387INin all388DTall three389CDthree cases390NNScase that391IN/thatthat we392PPwe have393VHPhave ,394,, the395DTthe prosecutor396NNprosecutor initially397RBinitially charged398VVDcharge false399JJfalse Social400NPSocial Security401NPSecurity number402NNnumber on403INon the404DTthe I-9405NPI-9 ,406,, and407CCand it408PPit was409VBDbe only410RBonly when411WRBwhen the412DTthe prosecutor413NNprosecutor appreciated414VVDappreciate that415IN/thatthat that416WDTthat could417MDcould n't418RBn't be419VBbe done420VVNdo that421IN/thatthat the422DTthe I-9423NPI-9 charge424NNcharge was425VBDbe deleted426VVNdelete ?427SENT? [GENERAL SCHMIDT]428LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] I429PPI think430VVPthink these431DTthese cases432NNScase are433VBPbe here434RBhere ,435,, Justice436NPJustice Ginsburg437NPGinsburg ,438,, because439INbecause they440PPthey do441VVPdo ,442,, of443INof course444NNcourse ,445,, present446VVpresent the447DTthe issue448NNissue of449INof the450DTthe intersection451NNintersection between452INbetween IRCA453NPIRCA and454CCand generally455RBgenerally applicable456JJapplicable state457NNstate law458NNlaw .459SENT. These460DTthese cases461NNScase all462RBall straddled463VVNstraddle ,464,, in465INin their466PP$their time467NNtime lines468NNSline ,469,, this470DTthis Court471NPCourt 's472POS's decision473NNdecision in474INin Arizona475NPArizona .476SENT. And477CCand I478PPI think479VVPthink that480WDTthat explains481VVZexplain why482WRBwhy the483DTthe state484NNstate originally485RBoriginally attempted486VVDattempt to487TOto use488VVuse the489DTthe I-9490NPI-9 ,491,, then492RBthen understood493VVDunderstand this494DTthis Court495NPCourt 's496POS's holding497NNholding in498INin Arizona499NPArizona ,500,, and501CCand withdrew502VVDwithdraw from503INfrom use504NNuse of505INof the506DTthe 21507CD@card@ I-9508NNI-9 .509SENT. I510PPI would511MDwould point512VVpoint out513RPout ,514,, Your515PP$your Honor516NPHonor ,517,, that518IN/thatthat all519DTall three520CDthree cases521NNScase arose522VVDarise ,523,, were524VBDbe discovered525VVNdiscover ,526,, the527DTthe fraud528NNfraud was529VBDbe discovered530VVNdiscover ,531,, in532INin a533DTa context534NNcontext outside535INoutside the536DTthe employment537NNemployment setting538NNsetting .539SENT. This540DTthis is541VBZbe not542RBnot what543WPwhat was544VBDbe happening545VVGhappen in546INin subsequent547JJsubsequent cases548NNScase in549INin Arizona550NPArizona .551SENT. Mr552NPMr .553SENT. Garcia554NPGarcia 's555POS's fraud556NNfraud was557VBDbe discovered558VVNdiscover first559RBfirst in560INin a561DTa records562NNSrecord check563VVPcheck at564INat a565DTa traffic566NNtraffic stop567NNstop ;568:; Mr569NPMr .570SENT. Morales571NPMorales ,572,, from573INfrom a574DTa separate575JJseparate investigation576NNinvestigation related577VVNrelate to578TOto workers579NNSworker '580POS' compensation581NNcompensation ;582:; and583CCand Mr584NPMr .585SENT. Ochoa-Lara586NPOchoa-Lara ,587,, from588INfrom a589DTa separate590JJseparate investigation591NNinvestigation ...592:... [CHIEF JUSTICE ROBERTS]593LOC[CHIEF JUSTICE ROBERTS] Do594VVdo you595PPyou ...596:... [GENERAL SCHMIDT]597LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] ...598:... of599INof different600JJdifferent criminal601JJcriminal conduct602NNconduct in603INin the604DTthe department605NNdepartment .606SENT. [CHIEF JUSTICE ROBERTS]607LOC[CHIEF JUSTICE ROBERTS] ...608:... do609VVPdo you610PPyou agree611VVPagree that612IN/thatthat the613DTthe result614NNresult would615MDwould be616VBbe different617JJdifferent if618INif the619DTthe information620NNinformation was621VBDbe harvested622VVNharvest from623INfrom the624DTthe I-9s625NPI-9s ;626:; in627INin other628JJother words629NNSword ,630,, if631INif state632NNstate officials633NNSofficial went634VVDgo to635TOto employers636NNSemployer ,637,, said638VVDsay let639VVlet me640PPme see641VVsee your642PP$your I-9s643NNSI-9s ,644,, and645CCand then646RBthen that647WDTthat is648VBZbe used649VVNuse to650TOto gather651VVgather information652NNinformation that653WDTthat 's654VBZbe used655VVNuse in656INin the657DTthe Kansas658NPKansas prosecutions659NNSprosecution ?660SENT? [GENERAL SCHMIDT]661LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] I662PPI think663VVPthink it664PPit likely665RBlikely would666MDwould ,667,, Your668PP$your Honor669NPHonor .670SENT. That671DTthat is672VBZbe not673RBnot what674WPwhat happened675VVDhappen here676RBhere ,677,, and678CCand it679PPit 's680VBZbe not681RBnot supported682VVNsupport on683INon these684DTthese records685NNSrecord .686SENT. And687CCand I688PPI recognize689VVPrecognize that690DTthat is691VBZbe a692DTa more693RBRmore difficult694JJdifficult case695NNcase .696SENT. We697PPwe concede698VVPconcede that699IN/thatthat the700DTthe state701NNstate may702MDmay not703RBnot use704VVuse the705DTthe I-9706NPI-9 form707NNform .708SENT. Whether709INwhether that710DTthat extends711VVZextend to712TOto a713DTa use714NNuse investigation715NNinvestigation ,716,, I717PPI think718VVPthink ,719,, is720VBZbe ...721:... is722VBZbe perhaps723RBperhaps a724DTa somewhat725RBsomewhat different726JJdifferent question727NNquestion ,728,, not729RBnot presented730VVNpresent here731RBhere .732SENT. I733PPI recognize734VVPrecognize it735PPit 's736VBZbe difficult737JJdifficult ,738,, and739CCand we740PPwe do741VVPdo n't742RBn't claim743VVclaim that744DTthat ground745NNground ,746,, but747CCbut I748PPI do749VVPdo n't750RBn't want751VVwant to752TOto concede753VVconcede it754PPit more755RBRmore generally756RBgenerally .757SENT. [JUSTICE GINSBURG]758LOC[JUSTICE GINSBURG] But759CCbut the760DTthe package761NNpackage that762WDTthat was763VBDbe submitted764VVNsubmit to765TOto the766DTthe employer767NNemployer was768VBDbe all769RBall in770INin one771CDone package772NNpackage ,773,, the774DTthe I-9775NPI-9 ,776,, the777DTthe withholding778NNwithholding form779NNform ,780,, federal781JJfederal and782CCand state783NNstate .784SENT. It785PPit 's786VBZbe not787RBnot that788IN/thatthat these789DTthese were790VBDbe discrete791JJdiscrete episodes792NNSepisode .793SENT. It794PPit ...795:... and796CCand ...797:... and798CCand in799INin all800DTall three801CDthree cases802NNScase ,803,, the804DTthe tax805NNtax form806NNform ,807,, the808DTthe I-9809NPI-9 ,810,, the811DTthe state812NNstate tax813NNtax form814NNform was815VBDbe all816RBall for817INfor the818DTthe same819JJsame benefit820NNbenefit ,821,, that822WDTthat was823VBDbe to824TOto gain825VVgain employment826NNemployment .827SENT. You828PPyou can829MDcan 't830RB't gain831NNgain employment832NNemployment without833INwithout filling834VVGfill out835RPout those836DTthose withholding837NNwithholding forms838NNSform .839SENT. [GENERAL SCHMIDT]840LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] That841DTthat 's842VBZbe true843JJtrue ,844,, Justice845NPJustice Ginsburg846NPGinsburg ,847,, and848CCand I849PPI think850VVPthink that851WDTthat speaks852VVZspeak to853TOto the854DTthe important855JJimportant distinction856NNdistinction that857WDTthat 's858VBZbe at859INat issue860NNissue in861INin this862DTthis case863NNcase .864SENT. Our865PP$our view866NNview of867INof what868WPwhat Congress869NPCongress did870VVDdo in871INin 1986872CD@card@ against873INagainst the874DTthe backdrop875NNbackdrop of876INof this877DTthis Court878NPCourt 's879POS's decision880NNdecision in881INin DeCanas882NPDeCanas ,883,, that884WDTthat prior885RBprior to886TOto IRCA887NPIRCA the888DTthe employment889NNemployment process890NNprocess generally891RBgenerally was892VBDbe available893JJavailable to894TOto ...895:... was896VBDbe within897INwithin the898DTthe scope899NNscope of900INof state901NNstate criminal902JJcriminal law903NNlaw .904SENT. In905INin 1986906CD@card@ ,907,, Congress908NPCongress created909VVDcreate something910NNsomething new911JJnew and912CCand different913JJdifferent .914SENT. It915PPit created916VVDcreate this917DTthis I-9918NPI-9 system919NNsystem which920WDTwhich was921VBDbe a922DTa novelty923NNnovelty at924INat the925DTthe time926NNtime .927SENT. With928INwith the929DTthe force930NNforce of931INof federal932JJfederal law933NNlaw ,934,, Congress935NPCongress was936VBDbe ordering937VVGorder millions938NNSmillion of939INof private940JJprivate employers941NNSemployer around942INaround the943DTthe country944NNcountry to945TOto gather946VVgather up947RPup personal948JJpersonal information949NNinformation of950INof their951PP$their employees952NNSemployee or953CCor potential954JJpotential employees955NNSemployee and956CCand to957TOto hold958VVhold that959DTthat information960NNinformation .961SENT. So962INso Congress963NPCongress was964VBDbe understandably965RBunderstandably concerned966VVNconcern about967RBabout how968WRBhow employers969NNSemployer and970CCand others971NNSother might972MDmight use973VVuse that974DTthat information975NNinformation .976SENT. That977DTthat 's978VBZbe why979WRBwhy they980PPthey put981VVDput the982DTthe safeguards983NNSsafeguard in984INin .985SENT. The986DTthe distinction987NNdistinction ,988,, we989PPwe believe990VVPbelieve ,991,, that992WDTthat 's993VHZhave been994VBNbe drawn995VVNdraw is996VBZbe between997INbetween the998DTthe I-9999NPI-9 system1000NNsystem itself1001PPitself ,1002,, which1003WDTwhich Congress1004NPCongress created1005VVDcreate and1006CCand placed1007VVDplace off1008RPoff limits1009NNSlimit ,1010,, and1011CCand the1012DTthe broader1013JJRbroad employment1014NNemployment hiring1015VVGhire context1016NNcontext ,1017,, which1018WDTwhich states1019NNSstate have1020VHPhave traditionally1021RBtraditionally been1022VBNbe able1023JJable to1024TOto reach1025VVreach and1026CCand we1027PPwe believe1028VVPbelieve still1029RBstill can1030MDcan reach1031VVreach .1032SENT. And1033CCand so1034RBso ,1035,, in1036INin the1037DTthe question1038NNquestion that1039IN/thatthat Your1040PP$your Honor1041NPHonor has1042VHZhave posed1043VVNpose ,1044,, the1045DTthe fact1046NNfact that1047IN/thatthat documents1048NNSdocument might1049MDmight be1050VBbe submitted1051VVNsubmit at1052INat the1053DTthe same1054JJsame time1055NNtime all1056RBall for1057INfor a1058DTa purpose1059NNpurpose of1060INof obtaining1061VVGobtain a1062DTa job1063NNjob does1064VVZdo not1065RBnot transform1066VVtransform tax1067NNtax withholding1068NNwithholding forms1069NNSform or1070CCor any1071DTany other1072JJother hiring1073NNhiring documents1074NNSdocument like1075INlike a1076DTa resume1077NNresume ,1078,, a1079DTa job1080NNjob application1081NNapplication ,1082,, a1083DTa background1084NNbackground check1085NNcheck form1086NNform ,1087,, into1088INinto part1089NNpart of1090INof the1091DTthe I-91092NPI-9 system1093NNsystem .1094SENT. [JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR]1095LOC[JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR] May1096NPmay I1097PPI ...1098:... [GENERAL SCHMIDT]1099LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] And1100CCand that1101IN/thatthat system1102NNsystem is1103VBZbe what1104WPwhat 's1105VBZbe permitted1106VVNpermit .1107SENT. [JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR]1108LOC[JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR] Can1109MDcan I1110PPI unpackage1111VVunpackage your1112PP$your argument1113NNargument a1114DTa little1115JJlittle bit1116NNbit ?1117SENT? Is1118VBZbe it1119PPit your1120PP$your position1121NNposition ...1122:... I1123PPI seem1124VVPseem ...1125:... you1126PPyou seem1127VVPseem to1128TOto be1129VBbe conceding1130VVGconcede that1131IN/thatthat you1132PPyou can1133MDcan 't1134RB't use1135VVuse the1136DTthe ...1137:... prosecute1138VVprosecute for1139INfor any1140DTany false1141JJfalse statements1142NNSstatement on1143INon the1144DTthe I-91145NPI-9 form1146NNform ,1147,, correct1148JJcorrect ?1149SENT? [GENERAL SCHMIDT]1150LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] Your1151PP$your Honor1152NPHonor ,1153,, as1154INas I1155PPI 've1156VHPhave said1157VVNsay to1158TOto the1159DTthe Chief1160NPChief Justice1161NPJustice ,1162,, we1163PPwe are1164VBPbe n't1165RBn't doing1166VVGdo that1167DTthat .1168SENT. We1169PPwe concede1170VVPconcede ...1171:... we1172PPwe do1173VVPdo n't1174RBn't intend1175VVintend to1176TOto do1177VVdo that1178DTthat .1179SENT. I1180PPI think1181VVPthink ...1182:... [JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR]1183LOC[JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR] All1184DTall right1185NNright .1186SENT. [GENERAL SCHMIDT]1187LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] ...1188:... maybe1189RBmaybe for1190INfor a1191DTa broader1192JJRbroad purpose1193NNpurpose ,1194,, that1195WDTthat 's1196VBZbe a1197DTa different1198JJdifferent case1199NNcase .1200SENT. [JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR]1201LOC[JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR] So1202INso what1203WPwhat meaning1204NNmeaning do1205VVPdo you1206PPyou give1207VVgive to1208TOto the1209DTthe part1210NNpart of1211INof the1212DTthe preemption1213NNpreemption language1214NNlanguage that1215WDTthat says1216VVZsay you1217PPyou can1218MDcan 't1219RB't use1220VVuse the1221DTthe form1222NNform in1223INin any1224DTany way1225NNway ?1226SENT? The1227DTthe precise1228JJprecise language1229NNlanguage is1230VBZbe ,1231,, I1232PPI think1233VVPthink ...1234:... I1235PPI do1236VVPdo n't1237RBn't have1238VHhave it1239PPit .1240SENT. [GENERAL SCHMIDT]1241LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] Is1242VBZbe that1243IN/thatthat the1244DTthe language1245NNlanguage in1246INin (1247(( b1248LSb )1249)) (1250(( 51251LS5 )1252)) ,1253,, Your1254PP$your Honor1255NPHonor ,1256,, where1257WRBwhere the1258DTthe ...1259:... [JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR]1260LOC[JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR] Exactly1261RBexactly .1262SENT. [GENERAL SCHMIDT]1263LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] ...1264:... where1265WRBwhere Congress1266NPCongress ...1267:... [JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR]1268LOC[JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR] So1269RBso ,1270,, if1271INif you1272PPyou can1273MDcan 't1274RB't use1275VVuse it1276PPit in1277INin any1278DTany way1279NNway ,1280,, why1281WRBwhy can1282MDcan you1283PPyou use1284VVuse the1285DTthe information1286NNinformation contained1287VVDcontain therein1288RBtherein for1289INfor employment1290NNemployment verification1291NNverification ?1292SENT? Meaning1293VVGmean I1294PPI certainly1295RBcertainly do1296VVPdo understand1297VVunderstand an1298DTan independent1299JJindependent verification1300NNverification ,1301,, like1302INlike a1303DTa criminal1304JJcriminal check1305NNcheck ,1306,, criminal1307JJcriminal law1308NNlaw check1309NNcheck .1310SENT. But1311CCbut you1312PPyou 're1313VBPbe still1314RBstill using1315VVGuse it1316PPit for1317INfor employment1318NNemployment verification1319NNverification ,1320,, correct1321JJcorrect ?1322SENT? [GENERAL SCHMIDT]1323LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] Well1324UHwell ,1325,, I1326PPI think1327VVPthink not1328RBnot ,1329,, Your1330PP$your Honor1331NPHonor .1332SENT. And1333CCand ...1334:... and1335CCand perhaps1336RBperhaps it1337PPit 's1338VBZbe a1339DTa linguistic1340JJlinguistic distinction1341NNdistinction ,1342,, but1343CCbut I1344PPI want1345VVPwant to1346TOto be1347VBbe clear1348JJclear on1349INon what1350WPwhat our1351PP$our point1352NNpoint is1353VBZbe .1354SENT. [JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR]1355LOC[JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR] Well1356UHWell ,1357,, that1358WDTthat 's1359VBZbe why1360WRBwhy I1361PPI 'm1362VBPbe having1363VHGhave a1364DTa problem1365NNproblem ,1366,, which1367WDTwhich is1368VBZbe I1369PPI 'm1370VBPbe not1371RBnot quite1372RBquite sure1373JJsure how1374WRBhow the1375DTthe ...1376:... how1377WRBhow ...1378:... [GENERAL SCHMIDT]1379LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] We1380PPwe ...1381:... we1382PPwe ...1383:... [JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR]1384LOC[JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR] ...1385:... you1386PPyou can1387MDcan concede1388VVconcede one1389CDone without1390INwithout conceding1391VVGconcede the1392DTthe second1393NNsecond .1394SENT. [GENERAL SCHMIDT]1395LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] ...1396:... we1397PPwe think1398VVPthink that1399IN/thatthat employment1400NNemployment verification1401NNverification is1402VBZbe ...1403:... is1404VBZbe best1405RBSwell used1406VVNuse to1407TOto describe1408VVdescribe the1409DTthe I-91410NPI-9 system1411NNsystem that1412IN/thatthat Congress1413NPCongress created1414VVDcreate in1415INin the1416DTthe IRCA1417NPIRCA .1418SENT. In1419INin that1420DTthat subparagraph1421NNsubparagraph (1422(( b1423LSb )1424)) of1425INof IRCA1426NPIRCA ,1427,, those1428DTthose first1429JJfirst three1430CDthree paragraphs1431NNSparagraph ,1432,, Congress1433NPCongress set1434VVDset up1435RPup the1436DTthe system1437NNsystem of1438INof attestation1439NNattestation and1440CCand related1441JJrelated obligations1442NNSobligation .1443SENT. That1444DTthat is1445VBZbe what1446WPwhat verifies1447VVZverify employment1448NNemployment ,1449,, work1450NNwork authorization1451NNauthorization ,1452,, for1453INfor purposes1454NNSpurpose of1455INof federal1456JJfederal immigration1457NNimmigration law1458NNlaw .1459SENT. There1460EXthere are1461VBPbe other1462JJother things1463NNSthing in1464INin the1465DTthe employment1466NNemployment context1467NNcontext that1468WDTthat may1469MDmay be1470VBbe disqualifying1471VVGdisqualify for1472INfor obtaining1473VVGobtain a1474DTa job1475NNjob ,1476,, but1477CCbut those1478DTthose are1479VBPbe n't1480RBn't ,1481,, in1482INin our1483PP$our words1484NNSword ,1485,, employment1486NNemployment verification1487NNverification that1488IN/thatthat Congress1489NPCongress has1490VHZhave spoken1491VVNspeak to1492TOto .1493SENT. [JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR]1494LOC[JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR] All1495DTall right1496NNright .1497SENT. [JUSTICE GINSBURG]1498LOC[JUSTICE GINSBURG] It1499PPit 's1500VBZbe so1501RBso ...1502:... [JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR]1503LOC[JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR] I1504PPI understand1505VVPunderstand that1506IN/thatthat would1507MDwould ...1508:... [JUSTICE GINSBURG]1509LOC[JUSTICE GINSBURG] ...1510:... it1511PPit would1512MDwould be1513VBbe so1514RBso easy1515JJeasy to1516TOto circumvent1517VVcircumvent the1518DTthe I-91519NNI-9 then1520RBthen .1521SENT. All1522RBall they1523PPthey have1524VHPhave to1525TOto do1526VVdo is1527VBZbe to1528TOto switch1529VVswitch to1530TOto other1531JJother forms1532NNSform submitted1533VVNsubmit at1534INat the1535DTthe same1536JJsame time1537NNtime .1538SENT. [GENERAL SCHMIDT]1539LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] Well1540UHWell ,1541,, Your1542PP$your Honor1543NPHonor ,1544,, I1545PPI ...1546:... I1547PPI think1548VVPthink I1549PPI understand1550VVPunderstand the1551DTthe point1552NNpoint ,1553,, and1554CCand if1555INif I1556PPI understand1557VVPunderstand it1558PPit correctly1559RBcorrectly ,1560,, it1561PPit is1562VBZbe that1563DTthat information1564NNinformation that1565WDTthat is1566VBZbe false1567JJfalse ,1568,, stolen1569JJstolen information1570NNinformation from1571INfrom somebody1572NNsomebody else1573NNelse that1574WDTthat is1575VBZbe contemporaneously1576RBcontemporaneously submitted1577VVNsubmit to1578TOto an1579DTan employer1580NNemployer ,1581,, if1582INif it1583PPit 's1584VBZbe not1585RBnot the1586DTthe same1587JJsame false1588JJfalse information1589NNinformation on1590INon an1591DTan I-91592NPI-9 and1593CCand other1594JJother employment-related1595JJemployment-related documents1596NNSdocument ,1597,, it1598PPit would1599MDwould necessarily1600RBnecessarily reveal1601VVreveal the1602DTthe fraud1603NNfraud on1604INon the1605DTthe I-91606NPI-9 ,1607,, if1608INif I1609PPI 'm1610VBPbe understanding1611VVGunderstand Your1612PP$your Honor1613NPHonor 's1614POS's question1615NNquestion .1616SENT. That1617DTthat may1618MDmay well1619RBwell be1620VBbe .1621SENT. But1622CCbut that1623DTthat does1624VVZdo n't1625RBn't change1626VVchange the1627DTthe fact1628NNfact that1629IN/thatthat what1630WPwhat Congress1631NPCongress has1632VHZhave fenced1633VVNfence off1634RPoff here1635RBhere is1636VBZbe the1637DTthe I-91638JJI-9 verification1639NNverification system1640NNsystem ,1641,, not1642RBnot the1643DTthe tax1644NNtax withholding1645NNwithholding system1646NNsystem ,1647,, not1648RBnot other1649JJother aspects1650NNSaspect of1651INof the1652DTthe employment1653NNemployment relationship1654NNrelationship .1655SENT. And1656CCand if1657INif Congress1658NPCongress had1659VHDhave wanted1660VVNwant to1661TOto more1662RBRmore broadly1663RBbroadly exclude1664VVexclude states1665NNSstate from1666INfrom that1667DTthat role1668NNrole ,1669,, they1670PPthey knew1671VVDknow how1672WRBhow to1673TOto do1674VVdo it1675PPit .1676SENT. [JUSTICE KAVANAUGH]1677LOC[JUSTICE KAVANAUGH] But1678CCbut the1679DTthe two1680CDtwo things1681NNSthing ...1682:... [GENERAL SCHMIDT]1683LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] They1684PPthey ...1685:... [JUSTICE KAVANAUGH]1686LOC[JUSTICE KAVANAUGH] Sorry1687RBsorry .1688SENT. The1689DTthe two1690CDtwo things1691NNSthing ,1692,, as1693INas Justice1694NPJustice Ginsburg1695NPGinsburg points1696VVZpoint out1697RPout ,1698,, always1699RBalways go1700VVgo together1701RBtogether ,1702,, the1703DTthe I-91704NPI-9 form1705NNform and1706CCand the1707DTthe tax1708NNtax forms1709NNSform .1710SENT. In1711INin virtually1712RBvirtually all1713DTall employment1714NNemployment ,1715,, you1716PPyou 're1717VBPbe going1718VVGgo to1719TOto be1720VBbe asked1721VVNask for1722INfor a1723DTa Social1724NPSocial Security1725NPSecurity number1726NNnumber on1727INon both1728DTboth forms1729NNSform .1730SENT. And1731CCand so1732RBso the1733DTthe states1734NNSstate would1735MDwould ,1736,, in1737INin essence1738NNessence ,1739,, be1740VBbe able1741JJable to1742TOto go1743VVgo after1744INafter unauthorized1745JJunauthorized employment1746NNemployment in1747INin a1748DTa pretty1749JJpretty substantial1750JJsubstantial way1751NNway ,1752,, notwithstanding1753INnotwithstanding what1754WPwhat Congress1755NPCongress said1756VVDsay about1757INabout giving1758VVGgive the1759DTthe federal1760JJfederal government1761NNgovernment the1762DTthe role1763NNrole with1764INwith employment1765NNemployment verification1766NNverification .1767SENT. So1768RBso how1769WRBhow do1770VVPdo you1771PPyou answer1772VVanswer that1773DTthat concern1774NNconcern ,1775,, and1776CCand ,1777,, in1778INin particular1779JJparticular ,1780,, I1781PPI think1782VVPthink Arizona1783NPArizona 's1784POS's language1785NNlanguage on1786INon unauthorized1787JJunauthorized employment1788NNemployment ?1789SENT? [GENERAL SCHMIDT]1790LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] And1791CCand so1792RBso ,1793,, too1794RBtoo ,1795,, Justice1796NPJustice Kavanaugh1797NPKavanaugh ,1798,, ride1799VVPride together1800RBtogether background1801NNbackground checks1802NNScheck for1803INfor many1804JJmany ,1805,, many1806JJmany jobs1807NNSjob now1808RBnow ,1809,, not1810RBnot just1811RBjust traditionally1812RBtraditionally highly1813RBhighly sensitive1814JJsensitive ,1815,, with1816INwith teachers1817NNSteacher ,1818,, for1819INfor example1820NNexample ,1821,, and1822CCand employment1823NNemployment application1824NNapplication forms1825VVZform that1826DTthat ...1827:... [JUSTICE KAVANAUGH]1828LOC[JUSTICE KAVANAUGH] Let1829NPLet 's1830POS's just1831JJjust focus1832NNfocus ...1833:... let1834VVlet 's1835VBZbe just1836RBjust focus1837NNfocus on1838INon the1839DTthe I-91840NPI-9 and1841CCand the1842DTthe tax1843NNtax forms1844NNSform and1845CCand Social1846NPSocial Security1847NPSecurity numbers1848NNSnumber because1849INbecause that1850WDTthat 's1851VBZbe ...1852:... [GENERAL SCHMIDT]1853LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] Right1854RBright .1855SENT. [JUSTICE KAVANAUGH]1856LOC[JUSTICE KAVANAUGH] ...1857:... what1858WPwhat this1859DTthis is1860VBZbe about1861RBabout .1862SENT. And1863CCand that1864DTthat 's1865VBZbe going1866VVGgo to1867TOto be1868VBbe what1869WPwhat a1870DTa lot1871NNlot of1872INof these1873DTthese cases1874NNScase are1875VBPbe about1876RBabout ,1877,, I1878PPI would1879MDwould think1880VVthink ,1881,, if1882INif you1883PPyou prevail1884VVPprevail here1885RBhere .1886SENT. [GENERAL SCHMIDT]1887LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] Then1888RBthen I1889PPI think1890VVPthink ,1891,, Justice1892NPJustice Kavanaugh1893NPKavanaugh ,1894,, that1895IN/thatthat the1896DTthe ...1897:... the1898DTthe best1899JJSgood answer1900NNanswer to1901TOto that1902DTthat is1903VBZbe what1904WPwhat Congress1905NPCongress did1906VVDdo not1907RBnot do1908VVdo .1909SENT. And1910CCand if1911INif one1912CDone looks1913NNSlook ,1914,, for1915INfor example1916NNexample ,1917,, at1918INat 261919CD@card@ U1920NPU .1921SENT. S1922NPS .1923SENT. C1924LSc .1925SENT. 72051926CD@card@ ,1927,, which1928WDTwhich is1929VBZbe a1930DTa specific1931JJspecific federal1932JJfederal crime1933NNcrime that1934WDTthat makes1935VVZmake fraud1936NNfraud on1937INon a1938DTa W-41939NPW-4 form1940NNform ,1941,, I1942PPI believe1943VVPbelieve it1944PPit 's1945VBZbe a1946DTa federal1947JJfederal misdemeanor1948NNmisdemeanor ,1949,, Congress1950NPCongress did1951VVDdo not1952RBnot carve1953VVcarve that1954IN/thatthat out1955RBout in1956INin the1957DTthe use1958NNuse exception1959NNexception that1960IN/thatthat it1961PPit created1962VVDcreate in1963RPin (1964(( b1965LSb )1966)) (1967(( 51968LS5 )1969)) .1970SENT. It1971PPit is1972VBZbe nearly1973RBnearly nonsensical1974JJnonsensical to1975TOto think1976VVthink that1977DTthat Congress1978NPCongress on1979INon the1980DTthe one1981CDone hand1982NNhand would1983MDwould have1984VHhave created1985VVNcreate a1986DTa specific1987JJspecific crime1988NNcrime for1989INfor W-41990NPW-4 fraud1991NNfraud and1992CCand yet1993RByet precluded1994VVNpreclude its1995PP$its application1996NNapplication in1997INin situations1998NNSsituation in1999INin which2000WDTwhich the2001DTthe W-42002NPW-4 is2003VBZbe most2004RBSmost commonly2005RBcommonly submitted2006VVNsubmit ,2007,, together2008RBtogether with2009INwith the2010DTthe 212011CD@card@ I-92012NNI-9 .2013SENT. It2014PPit must2015MDmust be2016VBbe that2017IN/thatthat Congress2018NPCongress did2019VVDdo not2020RBnot consider2021VVconsider the2022DTthe umbrella2023NNumbrella of2024INof immunity2025NNimmunity as2026RBas to2027TOto the2028DTthe I-92029NPI-9 to2030TOto extend2031VVextend so2032RBso far2033RBfar as2034RBas to2035TOto hit2036VVhit the2037DTthe W-42038NPW-4 ,2039,, and2040CCand ,2041,, of2042INof course2043NNcourse ,2044,, Congress2045NPCongress certainly2046RBcertainly did2047VVDdo n't2048RBn't consider2049VVconsider the2050DTthe immunity2051NNimmunity it2052PPit was2053VBDbe granting2054VVGgrant with2055INwith respect2056NNrespect to2057TOto the2058DTthe I-92059NNI-9 to2060TOto the2061DTthe extent2062NNextent it2063PPit did2064VVDdo to2065TOto extend2066VVextend to2067TOto the2068DTthe state2069NNstate tax2070NNtax withholding2071NNwithholding form2072NNform ,2073,, the2074DTthe K-42075NPK-4 .2076SENT. [JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR]2077LOC[JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR] You2078PPyou could2079MDcould n't2080RBn't ...2081:... you2082PPyou could2083MDcould n't2084RBn't sue2085VVsue or2086CCor prosecute2087VVprosecute a2088DTa case2089NNcase for2090INfor someone2091NNsomeone 's2092POS's fraud2093NNfraud on2094INon the2095DTthe W-42096NPW-4 and2097CCand name2098VVname the2099DTthe U2100NPU .2101SENT. S2102NPS .2103SENT. as2104INas a2105DTa victim2106NNvictim ,2107,, correct2108JJcorrect ?2109SENT? The2110DTthe fraud2111NNfraud is2112VBZbe on2113INon the2114DTthe government2115NNgovernment because2116INbecause W-4s2117NPW-4s are2118VBPbe submitted2119VVNsubmit to2120TOto the2121DTthe government2122NNgovernment for2123INfor tax2124NNtax purposes2125NNSpurpose ,2126,, correct2127JJcorrect ?2128SENT? [GENERAL SCHMIDT]2129LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] I2130PPI ...2131:... I2132PPI think2133VVPthink ...2134:... [JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR]2135LOC[JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR] You2136PPyou do2137VVPdo n't2138RBn't have2139VHhave the2140DTthe power2141NNpower as2142INas a2143DTa state2144NNstate ...2145:... [GENERAL SCHMIDT]2146LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] I2147PPI am2148VBPbe ...2149:... I2150PPI 'm2151VBPbe sorry2152JJsorry ,2153,, Your2154PP$your Honor2155NPHonor .2156SENT. [JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR]2157LOC[JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR] I2158PPI do2159VVPdo n't2160RBn't believe2161VVbelieve you2162PPyou have2163VHPhave a2164DTa power2165NNpower as2166INas a2167DTa state2168NNstate to2169TOto prosecute2170VVprosecute crimes2171NNScrime where2172WRBwhere the2173DTthe U2174NPU .2175SENT. S2176NPS .2177SENT. is2178VBZbe a2179DTa victim2180NNvictim .2181SENT. [GENERAL SCHMIDT]2182LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] I2183PPI ...2184:... I2185PPI ...2186:... I2187PPI am2188VBPbe ...2189:... I2190PPI am2191VBPbe certain2192JJcertain we2193PPwe do2194VVPdo n't2195RBn't do2196VVdo that2197IN/thatthat ,2198,, Your2199PP$your Honor2200NPHonor .2201SENT. [JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR]2202LOC[JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR] I2203PPI know2204VVPknow you2205PPyou do2206VVPdo n't2207RBn't .2208SENT. [GENERAL SCHMIDT]2209LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] What2210WPWhat I2211PPI 'm2212VBPbe struggling2213VVGstruggle with2214INwith is2215VBZbe ...2216:... [JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR]2217LOC[JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR] It2218PPit seems2219VVZseem like2220INlike there2221EXthere would2222MDwould be2223VBbe a2224DTa real2225JJreal separation2226NNseparation of2227INof powers2228NNSpower ,2229,, too2230RBtoo .2231SENT. [GENERAL SCHMIDT]2232LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] Yeah2233NPYeah .2234SENT. And2235CCand I2236PPI 'm2237VBPbe certain2238JJcertain we2239PPwe 're2240VBPbe not2241RBnot claiming2242VVGclaim that2243DTthat authority2244NNauthority ,2245,, Your2246PP$your Honor2247NPHonor .2248SENT. We2249PPwe 're2250VBPbe not2251RBnot trying2252VVGtry to2253TOto ...2254:... [JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR]2255LOC[JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR] So2256RBso why2257WRBwhy is2258VBZbe it2259PPit ...2260:... [GENERAL SCHMIDT]2261LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] ...2262:... vindicate2263VVvindicate the2264DTthe interests2265NNSinterest of2266INof the2267DTthe United2268NPUnited States2269NPSStates .2270SENT. [JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR]2271LOC[JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR] ...2272:... permissible2273JJpermissible for2274INfor you2275PPyou to2276TOto prosecute2277VVprosecute or2278CCor to2279TOto claim2280VVclaim there2281EXthere is2282VBZbe n't2283RBn't a2284DTa field2285NNfield preemption2286NNpreemption in2287INin doing2288VVGdo exactly2289RBexactly the2290DTthe same2291JJsame thing2292NNthing by2293INby calling2294VVGcall this2295DTthis a2296DTa fraud2297NNfraud under2298INunder state2299NNstate law2300NNlaw ,2301,, because2302INbecause the2303DTthe victim2304NNvictim has2305VHZhave to2306TOto be2307VBbe the2308DTthe U2309NPU .2310SENT. S2311NPS .2312SENT. [GENERAL SCHMIDT]2313LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] Well2314UHWell ,2315,, I2316PPI ...2317:... I'm2318NNI'm ...2319:... I2320PPI 'm2321VBPbe not2322RBnot sure2323JJsure the2324DTthe victim2325NNvictim does2326VVZdo have2327VHhave to2328TOto be2329VBbe the2330DTthe United2331NPUnited States2332NPSStates ,2333,, Your2334PP$your Honor2335NPHonor .2336SENT. I2337PPI think2338VVPthink the2339DTthe victims2340NNSvictim here2341RBhere are2342VBPbe the2343DTthe individuals2344NNSindividual whose2345WP$whose identities2346NNSidentity were2347VBDbe stolen2348VVNsteal and2349CCand misused2350VVNmisuse .2351SENT. [JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR]2352LOC[JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR] Ah2353UHah ,2354,, that2355WDTthat 's2356VHZhave stolen2357VVNsteal Social2358NPSocial Security2359NPSecurity ,2360,, but2361CCbut that2362WDTthat 's2363VBZbe different2364JJdifferent than2365INthan the2366DTthe fraud2367NNfraud that2368WDTthat ...2369:... of2370INof submitting2371VVGsubmit the2372DTthe W-42373NPW-4 to2374TOto the2375DTthe government2376NNgovernment .2377SENT. I2378PPI have2379VHPhave a2380DTa ...2381:... I2382PPI do2383VVPdo have2384VHhave problems2385NNSproblem with2386INwith the2387DTthe K-42388NPK-4 for2389INfor your2390PP$your other2391JJother side2392NNside to2393TOto answer2394VVanswer .2395SENT. But2396CCbut your2397PP$your theory2398NNtheory here2399RBhere on2400INon the2401DTthe K-42402NPK-4 ,2403,, I2404PPI did2405VVDdo n't2406RBn't see2407VVsee in2408INin the2409DTthe trial2410NNtrial record2411NNrecord where2412WRBwhere you2413PPyou argued2414VVDargue that2415IN/thatthat clearly2416RBclearly to2417TOto the2418DTthe three2419CDthree sets2420NNSset of2421INof juries2422NNSjury .2423SENT. [GENERAL SCHMIDT]2424LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] Your2425PP$your Honor2426NPHonor ,2427,, there2428EXthere was2429VBDbe ...2430:... Garcia2431NPGarcia was2432VBDbe the2433DTthe only2434JJonly case2435NNcase that2436WDTthat went2437VVDgo to2438TOto a2439DTa jury2440NNjury .2441SENT. The2442DTthe other2443JJother two2444CDtwo were2445VBDbe bench2446NNbench trials2447NNStrial .2448SENT. And2449CCand the2450DTthe K-42451NPK-4 was2452VBDbe present2453JJpresent ,2454,, I2455PPI believe2456VVPbelieve ,2457,, in2458INin two2459CDtwo of2460INof the2461DTthe cases2462NNScase ,2463,, in2464INin Mr2465NPMr .2466SENT. Garcia2467NPGarcia 's2468POS's case2469NNcase and2470CCand in2471INin Mr2472NPMr .2473SENT. Morales2474NPMorales '2475POS' case2476NNcase ,2477,, it2478PPit was2479VBDbe at2480INat least2481JJSleast in2482INin the2483DTthe charging2484VVGcharge affidavits2485NNSaffidavit .2486SENT. I2487PPI 'd2488MDwould have2489VHhave to2490TOto look2491VVlook at2492INat the2493DTthe record2494NNrecord more2495RBRmore carefully2496RBcarefully to2497TOto see2498VVsee if2499INif it2500PPit was2501VBDbe ...2502:... if2503INif it2504PPit carried2505VVDcarry through2506RPthrough .2507SENT. With2508INwith respect2509NNrespect to2510TOto the2511DTthe field2512NNfield issue2513NNissue ,2514,, Your2515PP$your Honor2516NPHonor ,2517,, this2518DTthis Court2519NPCourt has2520VHZhave never2521RBnever identified2522VVNidentify a2523DTa preempted2524VVNpreempt field2525NNfield in2526INin the2527DTthe employment2528NNemployment context2529NNcontext that2530WDTthat would2531MDwould be2532VBbe applicable2533JJapplicable here2534RBhere .2535SENT. And2536CCand to2537TOto the2538DTthe extent2539NNextent that2540WDTthat ...2541:... [JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR]2542LOC[JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR] Well2543UHWell ,2544,, Arizona2545NPArizona .2546SENT. [GENERAL SCHMIDT]2547LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] To2548NPTo ...2549:... well2550UHwell ,2551,, I2552PPI think2553VVPthink that2554IN/thatthat Arizona2555NPArizona ,2556,, as2557INas we2558PPwe read2559VVPread it2560PPit at2561INat least2562JJSleast ,2563,, Your2564PP$your Honor2565NPHonor ,2566,, with2567INwith respect2568NNrespect to2569TOto the2570DTthe employment2571NNemployment provision2572NNprovision ,2573,, the2574DTthe 52575CD5 (2576(( c2577LSc )2578)) provision2579NNprovision in2580INin Arizona2581NPArizona ,2582,, that2583WDTthat was2584VBDbe a2585DTa conflict2586NNconflict preemption2587NNpreemption analysis2588NNanalysis where2589WRBwhere Justice2590NPJustice Kennedy2591NPKennedy writing2592VVGwrite for2593INfor the2594DTthe Court2595NPCourt suggested2596VVDsuggest that2597IN/thatthat ,2598,, because2599INbecause of2600INof the2601DTthe method2602NNmethod the2603DTthe state2604NNstate was2605VBDbe using2606VVGuse ,2607,, the2608DTthe criminal2609JJcriminal law2610NNlaw ,2611,, Congress2612NPCongress in2613INin that2614DTthat application2615NNapplication in2616INin particular2617JJparticular had2618VHDhave declined2619VVNdecline to2620TOto use2621VVuse the2622DTthe criminal2623JJcriminal law2624NNlaw to2625TOto criminalize2626VVcriminalize work2627NNwork by2628INby unauthorized2629JJunauthorized aliens2630NNSalien .2631SENT. Here2632RBhere ,2633,, that2634IN/thatthat analysis2635NNanalysis is2636VBZbe n't2637RBn't present2638JJpresent at2639INat all2640DTall .2641SENT. Congress2642NPCongress has2643VHZhave criminalized2644VVNcriminalize fraud2645NNfraud ,2646,, as2647RBas well2648RBwell as2649INas identity2650NNidentity theft2651NNtheft .2652SENT. And2653CCand so2654RBso I2655PPI think2656VVPthink we2657PPwe 're2658VBPbe back2659RBback in2660INin the2661DTthe traditional2662JJtraditional world2663NNworld where2664WRBwhere we2665PPwe have2666VHPhave separate2667JJseparate sovereigns2668NNSsovereign who2669WPwho may2670MDmay go2671VVgo after2672INafter the2673DTthe same2674JJsame conduct2675NNconduct unless2676INunless it2677PPit 's2678VBZbe precluded2679VVNpreclude ,2680,, and2681CCand here2682RBhere it2683PPit is2684VBZbe not2685RBnot .2686SENT. With2687INwith respect2688NNrespect to2689TOto the2690DTthe field2691NNfield preemption2692NNpreemption issue2693NNissue as2694INas well2695RBwell ,2696,, I2697PPI think2698VVPthink it2699PPit would2700MDwould be2701VBbe difficult2702JJdifficult for2703INfor this2704DTthis Court2705NPCourt to2706TOto recognize2707VVrecognize a2708DTa preempted2709VVNpreempt field2710NNfield now2711RBnow ,2712,, particularly2713RBparticularly in2714INin light2715NNlight of2716INof the2717DTthe provision2718NNprovision of2719INof the2720DTthe holding2721NNholding in2722INin Whiting2723NPWhiting ,2724,, that2725WDTthat was2726VBDbe a2727DTa conflict2728NNconflict analysis2729NNanalysis holding2730NNholding ,2731,, but2732CCbut related2733VVNrelate to2734TOto the2735DTthe E-Verify2736NPE-Verify system2737NNsystem .2738SENT. It2739PPit 's2740VBZbe difficult2741JJdifficult to2742TOto imagine2743VVimagine how2744WRBhow there2745EXthere is2746VBZbe a2747DTa preempted2748VVNpreempt field2749NNfield states2750NNSstate may2751MDmay not2752RBnot enter2753VVenter ,2754,, even2755RBeven as2756RBas to2757TOto employment2758NNemployment verification2759NNverification narrowly2760RBnarrowly ,2761,, and2762CCand yet2763RByet ,2764,, at2765INat the2766DTthe same2767JJsame time2768NNtime ,2769,, it2770PPit was2771VBDbe permissible2772JJpermissible for2773INfor the2774DTthe State2775NPState of2776INof Arizona2777NPArizona to2778TOto order2779VVorder the2780DTthe use2781NNuse of2782INof the2783DTthe E-Verify2784NPE-Verify system2785NNsystem to2786TOto verify2787VVverify employment2788NNemployment under2789INunder federal2790JJfederal law2791NNlaw .2792SENT. [JUSTICE KAGAN]2793LOC[JUSTICE KAGAN] If2794INif I2795PPI could2796MDcould go2797VVgo back2798RBback to2799TOto Justice2800NPJustice Kavanaugh2801NPKavanaugh 's2802POS's question2803NNquestion ,2804,, because2805INbecause you2806PPyou recognize2807VVPrecognize that2808IN/thatthat you2809PPyou can2810MDcan 't2811RB't use2812VVuse the2813DTthe I-9s2814NPI-9s to2815TOto prosecute2816VVprosecute aliens2817NNSalien in2818INin this2819DTthis way2820NNway .2821SENT. But2822CCbut you2823PPyou also2824RBalso acknowledge2825VVPacknowledge that2826IN/thatthat the2827DTthe W-4s2828NPW-4s are2829VBPbe going2830VVGgo to2831TOto be2832VBbe present2833JJpresent in2834INin every2835DTevery case2836NNcase in2837INin which2838WDTwhich the2839DTthe I-9s2840NPI-9s will2841MDwill be2842VBbe present2843JJpresent ,2844,, which2845WDTwhich gives2846VVZgive you2847PPyou the2848DTthe ability2849NNability to2850TOto conduct2851VVconduct all2852PDTall the2853DTthe prosecutions2854NNSprosecution that2855IN/thatthat you2856PPyou could2857MDcould have2858VHhave done2859VVNdo through2860INthrough the2861DTthe I-9s2862NPI-9s .2863SENT. So2864RBso what2865WPwhat ...2866:... what2867WPwhat effect2868NNeffect then2869RBthen does2870VVZdo ...2871:... does2872VVZdo Congress2873NPCongress 's2874POS's bar2875NNbar on2876INon states2877NNSstate using2878VVGuse the2879DTthe I-9s2880NPI-9s ,2881,, in2882INin fact2883NNfact ,2884,, have2885VHPhave ?2886SENT? [GENERAL SCHMIDT]2887LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] I2888PPI ...2889:... I2890PPI think2891VVPthink ,2892,, Justice2893NPJustice Kagan2894NPKagan ,2895,, back2896RBback to2897TOto my2898PP$my earlier2899JJRearly point2900NNpoint about2901INabout what2902WPwhat Congress2903NPCongress was2904VBDbe doing2905VVGdo in2906INin our2907PP$our view2908NNview in2909INin 19862910CD@card@ ,2911,, remember2912VVPremember prior2913RBprior to2914TOto 19862915CD@card@ there2916RBthere was2917VBDbe no2918RBno federally2919RBfederally mandated2920VVNmandate very2921RBvery disparate2922JJdisparate requirement2923NNrequirement for2924INfor collection2925NNcollection of2926INof personal2927JJpersonal information2928NNinformation throughout2929INthroughout the2930DTthe country2931NNcountry by2932INby employers2933NNSemployer .2934SENT. And2935CCand Congress2936NPCongress was2937VBDbe very2938RBvery concerned2939VVNconcern about2940INabout what2941WPwhat now2942RBnow seems2943VVZseem commonplace2944JJcommonplace but2945CCbut at2946INat the2947DTthe time2948NNtime was2949VBDbe novel2950JJnovel .2951SENT. They2952PPthey were2953VBDbe concerned2954VVNconcern about2955RBabout how2956WRBhow that2957DTthat information2958NNinformation might2959MDmight be2960VBbe misused2961VVNmisuse .2962SENT. And2963CCand we2964PPwe think2965VVPthink that2966WDTthat explains2967VVZexplain the2968DTthe ...2969:... the2970DTthe Congress2971NPCongress 's2972POS's choice2973NNchoice of2974INof the2975DTthe language2976NNlanguage in2977INin (2978(( b2979LSb )2980)) (2981(( 52982LS5 )2983)) .2984SENT. They2985PPthey did2986VVDdo n't2987RBn't use2988VVuse traditional2989JJtraditional preemption2990NNpreemption language2991NNlanguage as2992INas they2993PPthey did2994VVDdo in2995RPin (2996(( h2997NNh )2998)) (2999(( 23000LS2 )3001)) as3002INas to3003TOto employers3004NNSemployer .3005SENT. If3006INif they3007PPthey wanted3008VVDwant to3009TOto exclude3010VVexclude states3011NNSstate from3012INfrom this3013DTthis area3014NNarea entirely3015RBentirely ,3016,, they3017PPthey could3018MDcould have3019VHhave done3020VVNdo it3021PPit ,3022,, they3023PPthey did3024VVDdo it3025PPit in3026INin this3027DTthis statute3028NNstatute ,3029,, as3030RBas to3031TOto employers3032NNSemployer in3033INin (3034(( h3035NNh )3036)) (3037(( 23038LS2 )3039)) .3040SENT. [JUSTICE KAVANAUGH]3041LOC[JUSTICE KAVANAUGH] But3042CCbut I3043PPI think3044VVPthink ...3045:... [GENERAL SCHMIDT]3046LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] But3047CCbut they3048PPthey used3049VVDuse different3050JJdifferent language3051NNlanguage in3052INin (3053(( b3054LSb )3055)) (3056(( 53057LS5 )3058)) ,3059,, a3060DTa more3061RBRmore passive3062JJpassive voice3063NNvoice .3064SENT. They3065PPthey did3066VVDdo n't3067RBn't talk3068VVtalk about3069INabout states3070NNSstate specifically3071RBspecifically at3072INat all3073DTall or3074CCor governments3075NNSgovernment specifically3076RBspecifically at3077INat all3078DTall .3079SENT. They3080PPthey simply3081RBsimply said3082VVDsay that3083IN/thatthat neither3084CCneither the3085DTthe form3086NNform ,3087,, nor3088CCnor information3089NNinformation on3090INon it3091PPit ,3092,, nor3093CCnor anything3094NNanything ...3095:... the3096DTthe attachments3097NNSattachment to3098TOto it3099PPit ,3100,, appended3101VVNappend to3102TOto it3103PPit ,3104,, may3105MDmay be3106VBbe used3107VVNuse .3108SENT. And3109CCand I3110PPI think3111VVPthink they3112PPthey were3113VBDbe principally3114RBprincipally worried3115VVNworry about3116RBabout how3117WRBhow employers3118NNSemployer might3119MDmight misuse3120VVmisuse it3121PPit .3122SENT. Of3123INof course3124NNcourse ,3125,, I3126PPI 'm3127VBPbe not3128RBnot suggesting3129VVGsuggest they3130PPthey were3131VBDbe inviting3132VVGinvite us3133PPus .3134SENT. I3135PPI 'm3136VBPbe just3137RBjust suggesting3138VVGsuggest that3139DTthat was3140VBDbe their3141PP$their focus3142NNfocus and3143CCand why3144WRBwhy they3145PPthey wrote3146VVDwrite the3147DTthe provision3148NNprovision the3149DTthe way3150NNway they3151PPthey did3152VVDdo .3153SENT. [JUSTICE KAGAN]3154LOC[JUSTICE KAGAN] But3155CCbut let3156VVlet me3157PPme ...3158:... let3159VVlet me3160PPme ask3161VVask the3162DTthe same3163JJsame question3164NNquestion ,3165,, maybe3166RBmaybe from3167INfrom a3168DTa different3169JJdifferent perspective3170NNperspective ,3171,, which3172WDTwhich is3173VBZbe our3174PP$our decision3175NNdecision in3176INin Arizona3177NPArizona ,3178,, because3179INbecause our3180PP$our decision3181NNdecision in3182INin Arizona3183NPArizona said3184VVDsay that3185IN/thatthat states3186NNSstate could3187MDcould ,3188,, in3189INin fact3190NNfact ,3191,, not3192RBnot prosecute3193VVprosecute unauthorized3194JJunauthorized employees3195NNSemployee for3196INfor seeking3197VVGseek employment3198NNemployment .3199SENT. And3200CCand ...3201:... but3202CCbut this3203DTthis gives3204VVZgive you3205PPyou a3206DTa tool3207NNtool to3208TOto do3209VVdo just3210RBjust that3211IN/thatthat in3212INin every3213DTevery single3214JJsingle case3215NNcase .3216SENT. So3217RBso essentially3218RBessentially it3219PPit eviscerates3220VVZeviscerate everything3221NNeverything that3222IN/thatthat we3223PPwe said3224VVDsay in3225INin Arizona3226NPArizona ,3227,, does3228VVZdo n't3229RBn't it3230PPit ?3231SENT? [GENERAL SCHMIDT]3232LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] Well3233UHWell ,3234,, Your3235PP$your Honor3236NPHonor ,3237,, as3238INas I3239PPI suggested3240VVDsuggest earlier3241RBRearlier ,3242,, the3243DTthe way3244NNway we3245PPwe read3246VVPread the3247DTthe reasoning3248NNreasoning in3249INin Arizona3250NPArizona is3251VBZbe not3252RBnot applicable3253JJapplicable here3254RBhere .3255SENT. So3256RBso we3257PPwe think3258VVPthink it3259PPit is3260VBZbe distinguished3261VVNdistinguish and3262CCand ...3263:... and3264CCand ...3265:... and3266CCand separate3267JJseparate .3268SENT. If3269INif this3270DTthis Court3271NPCourt were3272VBDbe to3273TOto ,3274,, in3275INin our3276PP$our view3277NNview at3278INat least3279JJSleast ,3280,, extend3281VVextend Arizona3282NPArizona to3283TOto cover3284VVcover this3285DTthis circumstance3286NNcircumstance ,3287,, you3288PPyou know3289VVPknow ,3290,, we3291PPwe think3292VVPthink that3293IN/thatthat would3294MDwould be3295VBbe a3296DTa very3297RBvery different3298JJdifferent type3299NNtype of3300INof case3301NNcase than3302INthan we3303PPwe have3304VHPhave .3305SENT. [JUSTICE KAGAN]3306LOC[JUSTICE KAGAN] Well3307UHwell ,3308,, you3309PPyou 're3310VBPbe talking3311VVGtalk about3312INabout extending3313VVGextend Arizona3314NPArizona ,3315,, but3316CCbut I3317PPI 'm3318VBPbe suggesting3319VVGsuggest that3320IN/thatthat if3321INif you3322PPyou are3323VBPbe right3324RBright on3325INon this3326DTthis case3327NNcase ,3328,, we3329PPwe ...3330:... we3331PPwe might3332MDmight as3333RBas well3334RBwell not3335RBnot have3336VHPhave issued3337VVNissue Arizona3338NPArizona .3339SENT. [GENERAL SCHMIDT]3340LOC[GENERAL SCHMIDT] No3341NPNo ,3342,, I3343PPI think3344VVPthink not3345RBnot ,3346,, Your3347PP$your Honor3348NPHonor ,3349,, because3350RBbecause ,3351,, again3352RBagain ,3353,, what3354WPwhat the3355DTthe state3356NNstate is3357VBZbe focused3358VVNfocus on3359INon here3360RBhere ,3361,, and3362CCand I3363PPI do3364VVPdo n't3365RBn't think3366VVthink this3367DTthis is3368VBZbe seriously3369RBseriously disputed3370VVNdispute ...3371:... mildly3372RBmildly ,3373,, perhaps3374RBperhaps ,3375,, in3376INin the3377DTthe record3378NNrecord ...3379:... is3380VBZbe vindicating3381VVGvindicate its3382PP$its traditional3383JJtraditional interest3384NNinterest in3385INin prosecuting3386VVGprosecute fraud3387NNfraud .3388SENT. The3389DTthe fact3390NNfact that3391IN/thatthat incidentally3392RBincidentally our3393PP$our generally3394RBgenerally applicable3395JJapplicable laws3396NNSlaw intersect3397VVPintersect with3398INwith the3399DTthe employment3400NNemployment context3401NNcontext or3402CCor perhaps3403RBperhaps the3404DTthe immigration3405NNimmigration context3406NNcontext does3407VVZdo not3408RBnot mean3409VVmean that3410IN/thatthat Congress3411NPCongress has3412VHZhave commanded3413VVNcommand ,3414,, nor3415CCnor should3416MDshould we3417PPwe carve3418VVcarve out3419RPout ,3420,, special3421JJspecial application3422NNapplication or3423CCor lack3424NNlack of3425INof application3426NNapplication of3427INof our3428PP$our general3429JJgeneral laws3430NNSlaw to3431TOto persons3432NNSperson because3433INbecause of3434INof their3435PP$their work3436NNwork authorization3437NNauthorization status3438NNstatus .3439SENT. In3440INin other3441JJother words3442NNSword ,3443,, Arizona3444NPArizona is3445VBZbe a3446DTa very3447RBvery different3448JJdifferent circumstance3449NNcircumstance .3450SENT. We3451PPwe are3452VBPbe n't3453RBn't targeting3454VVGtarget folks3455NNSfolk because3456INbecause of3457INof their3458PP$their status3459NNstatus .3460SENT. We3461PPwe are3462VBPbe enforcing3463VVGenforce our3464PP$our employment3465NNemployment ,3466,, our3467PP$our ...3468:... our3469PP$our identity3470NNidentity theft3471NNtheft laws3472NNSlaw ,3473,, and3474CCand we3475PPwe do3476VVPdo n't3477RBn't want3478VVwant to3479TOto give3480VVgive special3481JJspecial exception3482NNexception to3483TOto that3484DTthat to3485TOto people3486NNSpeople because3487INbecause of3488INof their3489PP$their status3490NNstatus .3491SENT. [CHIEF JUSTICE ROBERTS]3492LOC[CHIEF JUSTICE ROBERTS] Thank3493VVthank you3494PPyou ,3495,, counsel3496NNcounsel .3497SENT. Mr3498NPMr .3499SENT. Michel3500NPMichel .3501SENT.