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My main thought was just that relying on the corpus of Latin that I have read that itself is Greek translations (like the New Testament or Apostolic Fathers) Dude just read ffs. It’s in like the top 3 easiest languages to learn. This is exactly what I am talking about. Latin is not uniquely difficult. It is the easiest of the classical languages and substantially easier than any difficult moderate language, especially because the challenge is mostly limited in scope to reading. The difficulty of Latin is a myth that comes from classics departments and people ashamed that they spent 10 years getting a bachelor’s, master’s and PHD in a language they can’t read fluently. LLPSI has put out literally thousands of pages of graded readers. The content does exist. ROMA IN ITALIA EST ITALIA IN EUROPA EST ITS NOT THAT HARD
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Sure but you could learn to just read chinese and it would still probably be as easy as learning to speak french
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Icebreaker: what are your favourite commentaries/secondary sources for understanding Plato? Robin Waterfield's The First Philosophers is something I find myself going back to every time a really get into a dialogue. Even though Plato is never really the focus of the book at any point, its really good for contextualising his philosophy alongside what had gone before. Not only does it help one distinguish what might be original ideas from mere developments or rearticulations of already existing ones, but its also useful for clarifying some of the more esoteric references. Take Phaedo for instance, the dialogue ends with the hemlock working its way through Socrates: According to Philolaus: Therefore, there implication by Plato here is that Socrates' soul left his body at the point the cold reached his heart Previous Thread: Recent Plato-related threads:
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Sell me on Plato.. I read The Republic and The last days of Socrates.. I really despised both. The last days of Socrates was a long time ago now but from what I remember it was my first exposure to the Socratic method and it made me want to gouge my eyes out with how difficult Socrates made even the simplest conversation. The Republic was that but for 200 pages. He just waxes poetic about shit and does logical leaps that his audience doesn't seem to catch because he's hypnotized them with the boredom of endless questions. They're proposing a utopian state which never came to be and never could have been. They make conclusions based on speculation on ideal behaivour from all participants based on their postulations. It's absolute trash for any modern man. Sure if I was born 3000 years ago my mind would probably explode from all of the wisdom.. But it has no value today... Oh you might say it influenced this and that... But as work on its own and not a historical document, what is the value of it for the modern man? The only greek philosophers of any worth are Aristotle and Epicurus.
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I need her
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She'd break you, little man.
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In several of the books
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the sufferings of young werter
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Science kills faith because it slowly robs the world of the conditions where belief could even make sense. Once you start seeing the universe not as a stage for divine providence but as a system of impersonal forces and mathematical regularities the old framework collapses. The Christian promise of a purposeful cosmos overseen by a personal God gets hollowed out until it's just poetry without substance. What's left is this mechanistic machine-world indifferent to our existence where "meaning" is no longer baked into the structure of reality. That's why atheism and nihilism inevitably grow in the soil of scientific rationalism, it strips away the illusions that kept people anchored in hope. Nietzsche saw it clearly, the same devotion to truth that Christianity demanded ends up killing Christianity because science takes that demand to its logical conclusion. And when you stand in that stripped-down landscape you don't find God, you find a void. The more science advances the wider that void becomes until faith looks less like a foundation and more like a coping mechanism that can't survive its own children.
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Replying to your own threads? Anyways, just give us the transactivist lust ideology and save us the trouble of a 10+ non-sequitur strawman memes
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Agreed. Boring with an intolerable narrator
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Such is the affecting power of fiction and consequences of imagination.
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This is the greatest piece of American Literature I’ve ever read
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So you've only ever read one book.
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It's a good list, but I've tried to update it a bit a few years ago with better collections, a better post-2000 section, and books that better represent certain authors. I've been reading a lot, and already have a number of books I would add to my current chart (as well as remove The Rats):
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I'm really enjoying how these threads have been booming so much lately.
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Just finished WoT. I do not expect this character ranking to be unique, but fuck it
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why did you whitewash the cast?
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True I felt a bit like "What the fuck am i doing there and why the fuck am i reading it?" at the start but this book quickly became one of if not my favorite in the series. I guess it's just really well put together and all around great book. And all characters are pretty much one of the best in the series.
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I picked up this book at the library on a whim, am I about to have a bad time?
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SOON
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are these the malazan sequel books? How are they?
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I used to dabble in tarot for fun. I assure it's all bullshit and none of it ever came true.
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Skill issue
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Icebreaker: what are your favourite commentaries/secondary sources for understanding Plato? Robin Waterfield's The First Philosophers is something I find myself going back to every time a really get into a dialogue. Even though Plato is never really the focus of the book at any point, its really good for contextualising his philosophy alongside what had gone before. Not only does it help one distinguish what might be original ideas from mere developments or rearticulations of already existing ones, but its also useful for clarifying some of the more esoteric references. Take Phaedo for instance, the dialogue ends with the hemlock working its way through Socrates: According to Philolaus: Therefore, there implication by Plato here is that Socrates' soul left his body at the point the cold reached his heart Previous Thread: Recent Plato-related threads:
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Sell me on Plato.. I read The Republic and The last days of Socrates.. I really despised both. The last days of Socrates was a long time ago now but from what I remember it was my first exposure to the Socratic method and it made me want to gouge my eyes out with how difficult Socrates made even the simplest conversation. The Republic was that but for 200 pages. He just waxes poetic about shit and does logical leaps that his audience doesn't seem to catch because he's hypnotized them with the boredom of endless questions. They're proposing a utopian state which never came to be and never could have been. They make conclusions based on speculation on ideal behaivour from all participants based on their postulations. It's absolute trash for any modern man. Sure if I was born 3000 years ago my mind would probably explode from all of the wisdom.. But it has no value today... Oh you might say it influenced this and that... But as work on its own and not a historical document, what is the value of it for the modern man? The only greek philosophers of any worth are Aristotle and Epicurus.
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Feel bad for Muslims honestly. You have to watch your people be victims of several genocides and wars just for everything to culminate with the leaders of Muslim countries saying they support Tony Blair being put in charge of Gaza.
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Muslims got away with a lot of things outside of Mongols invasions, they had it easy and now for once century of humiliation everyone is crying
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My main thought was just that relying on the corpus of Latin that I have read that itself is Greek translations (like the New Testament or Apostolic Fathers) Dude just read ffs. It’s in like the top 3 easiest languages to learn. This is exactly what I am talking about. Latin is not uniquely difficult. It is the easiest of the classical languages and substantially easier than any difficult moderate language, especially because the challenge is mostly limited in scope to reading. The difficulty of Latin is a myth that comes from classics departments and people ashamed that they spent 10 years getting a bachelor’s, master’s and PHD in a language they can’t read fluently. LLPSI has put out literally thousands of pages of graded readers. The content does exist. ROMA IN ITALIA EST ITALIA IN EUROPA EST ITS NOT THAT HARD
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its a category iv language so its fairly hard to learn, i is easiest and v is hardest For english speakers:
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Haec non ego sed anonyma alia est.
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Opportunitatem vidi ac tuli lacessendi transphobos
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I believe you, but there’s an odd tendency among people who study Latin to treat it like it’s da hardest ever. Japanese grammar and lexical similarities to English are basically nonexistent. It’s far more alien in every way, and yet I’ve multiple times had people insist to me that Latin is harder.
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I think part of the difference is that you can watch kids' cartoons in Japanese and not in Latin. (You can also watch kids' cartoons in modern Hebrew, but it is a bit different from Biblical; I'm told it's on par with the difference between our English and Shakespeare's.)
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*recta *amica (Irata non sum quia scire non potuisti.)
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nunquam eris femina
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My diary
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Adultery is obviously a popular theme but more often the unfaithful party is the M.C. Some examples of cuck M.C.s:— WORK(S): Morte D’Arthur (Malory), Idylls of the King (Tennyson), etc KEK: King Arthur SLUT: Guinevere OTHER MAN: Lancelot WORK: Ulysses (James Joyce) KEK: Leopold Bloom SLUT: Molly OTHER MAN: Hugh Boylan WORK: As I Lay Dying (William Faulkner) KEK: Anse Bundren [not the single main character but one of them] SLUT: Addie OTHER MAN: Rev. Whitfield WORK: Claudius the God (Robert Graves) KEK: Claudius SLUT: Messalina OTHER MAN: Anyone and everyone WORK: East of Eden (John Steinbeck) KEK: Adam SLUT: Cathy Ames OTHER MAN: Many, starting with Charles on their wedding night IIRC WORK: The Short Happy Life Of Francis Macomber (Ernest Hemingway) KEK: Francis Macomber SLUT: Margot OTHER MAN: Robert Wilson WORK: The Sun Also Rises (Ernest Hemingway) KEK: Jake SLUT: Brett [they're not actually married IIRC but the emotional equation is the same] OTHER MAN: Several, most notably that bullfighter (Romero) WORK: Factotum (Charles Bukowski) KEK: Henry Chinaski SLUT: Jan [as above, not technically married, but a common-law marriage I guess] OTHER MAN: Large numbers of unnamed individuals WORK: Are These Actual Miles? (Raymond Carver) KEK: Narrator SLUT: His wife OTHER MAN: The guy who is buying the car If we allow the cuck not to be the M.C. then it gets a lot easier, obviously:— WORK: Iliad (Homer) KEK: Menelaus SLUT: Helen OTHER MAN: Paris WORK: Agamemnon (Aeschylus) KEK: Agamemnon SLUT: Clytemnestra OTHER MAN: Aegisthus WORK: Lady Chatterley’s Lover (D. H. Lawrence) KEK: Sir Clifford Chatterley SLUT: Constance OTHER MAN: Oliver Mellors Dozens more examples. Madame Bovary, Anna Karenina, etc. Many authors have a definite penchant for infidelity. John Updike, Iris Murdoch, Richard Yates, Alice Munro, John Cheever, etc. In many Raymond Carver stories the (male) narrator is the unfaithful one. Interestingly Shakespeare doesn't have many unfaithful wives. His most famous 'adultery' plots — Othello, Winter's Tale, Cymbeline — involve a husband incorrectly SUSPECTING infidelity.
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He's a big cervantes guy is why
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How is he ugly? He looks good. By the way, people constantly tell me I'm handsome
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It’s funny how everyone implicitly understood what the thread was about except you. Autist or retarded? Maybe both?
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i reccomend this book for anybody who wants something simple to read. its about the life of a man in 1920s/1930s alexandra egypt and the people he meets. it is written in a very unique style, it is as if you are looking into somebodies memories, it is a very dreamy and beautiful narration
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My father is a Western European and my mother is a South Eastern European. I also live in Western Europe. I want a tradwife, but I can't decide for her nationality. I live in one of the most racist parts of Western Europe, the locals here don't accept me despite having a Western surname and being fully white. But after having spent two years in South Eastern Europe I was treated like a foreigner too and was not accepted into their society. Should I get a Western European or a South Eastern European wife? Objectively speaking who has the better genes and the better character qualities?
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No woman wants you, you autistic fuck.
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For a while, I felt proud of landing a job as a programmer after teaching myself for a year. Some people told me it was quite an achievement, but my father said it was pure luck. That comment offended me for a while—he seemed to dismiss all the effort I had put in. It’s now been six years since I started working in this field. These days, I do the bare minimum. I have no real interest in coding anymore, and no willpower to change jobs. Looking back, I realize my father was right. I can’t think of a better word than luck to describe the mix of passion, discipline, willpower, and hard work I managed to muster at the time—something that had never happened before, and probably won’t happen again.
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Opening up to you about what happened was one of the stupidest fucking things I’ve ever done in my life.
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Tell the rest of the story
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I am an old millenial. But she as boomerrss is not fertile enough for my tastes. If she was a decade or two younger,:: I would go for it however. The dream/nightmare continues. She has dispelled me of every dogmatic analytic perspective I once held, by means of an almost dogmatic and analytic argumentation herself. Most recently, she demonstrated a proof for the possibility of bilocation as well as the existence of soul as a non-physical body of energetic fields using a secondary work on Ulrich called The Physics and Metaphysics of Transibstantiation. She also made cryptic references to my dreams recently several times, I can only suspect she is playing with my immortal soul at this point. I just cannot tell if I should become Catholic as per my forefathers or follow her down whatever horrifying yet fascinating strain of gnosticism it seems she is ultimately leading me up to. She claims that I remind her of her dead husband. She has a child a generation younger than I. Male. I am afraid I will meet him at some point.
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If you were a Platonist and had a good understanding of the One, I think you could understand why someone might agree to simply dying painfully in exchange for ascending to it. You might not necessarily think such people were correct about their beliefs, but if you yourself spoke the same language, you could at least understand where they were coming from.
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Not that anon but he gave you the direct example of where Heidegger made a philosophically-incorrect claim about earlier western metaphysics, which you chose not to engage with and instead all you disputed was his understanding of the history of Heidegger studying and understanding things, not with the core philosophical claim itself. The aggressive posturing seems gay and histrionic in the absence of any response to the core point of the matter.
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I’ve been enjoying this 90s sci-fi horror anthology (it also has Lovecraft, Frank Belknap Long, Clark Ashton Smith, Ray Bradbury, PKD, and Richard Matheson in it)
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Holy shit anon. I’ve been trying to remember this anthology for almost 30 years. When I was like 11 my mom let me buy a book at the grocery store and I got this because the cover was cool as hell. I have wanted to remember it for so long because I absolutely loved one of the stories in it (Born of Man and Woman) that left an impression on me. I thought I’d never see it again. This is awesome. I’m gonna order a copy for old times sakes. Thanks!
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Has anyone read The Troop by Nick Cutter? So far I'm about 7 chapters in, not very far. I'm not sure if I'm liking it or not. I like the premise and sometimes, when it gets going, it's a good read. But it's a bit strange how he spends about 4 pages going on about a boy being a nerd and ranking the "alpha maleism" of the other boys. He's constantly mentioning how big and strong this boy is. Think he mentioned the flying spaghetti monster and talked about male ego and sometimes it feels like 2 different people had their hand in this. One being Nick Cutter and the other a female Redditor. I don't know, just seems bizarre to me. It's not that I'm having a particularly bad time reading it, it's just little things like that take me out of it briefly before continuing. Not to mention he will spend a page describing the same thing with 4 different metaphors. Is it worth pushing through?
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I enjoyed it. If you're an animal lover you're going to have a bad time
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Is ChatGPT a viable way to understand books? I'm reading Man and His Symbols, and pretty much after every page or two I'm left thinking like "what the fuck is he talking about??" and so I take a picture of the page and ask chatgpt what the meaning is, does anyone else do this?
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just search the keywords on your search engine of choice. never ask AI for anything if you want a real answer
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Just take out the sum. We know it's you because of scire and potuisti
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Ah, you mean I need to Omit Needless Words like a Roman. Right, makes sense.
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Oh cool? What edition of it should I buy? Is his stuff in-print currently or should I go for a used copy? Also interms of “occult detective” type stuff, is “carnaki the ghost hunter” by Hodgeson or “John silence” by Algernon Blackwood worth checking out?
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I read the Wellman through my local library so I can’t comment too much but I’ve also read the Hodgson and some of the Blackwood (still making my way through the collected John Silence this month). I like both of them and think they’re worth reading. Carnacki is a bit weirder and more entertaining— the stakes tend to be higher and world building Hodgson gestures to is really fun— but John Silence is in more accessible prose and deals with the paranormal from a more grounded and considered perspective. Another option in Seabury Quinn’s Jules de Grandin
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I think part of the difference is that you can watch kids' cartoons in Japanese and not in Latin. (You can also watch kids' cartoons in modern Hebrew, but it is a bit different from Biblical; I'm told it's on par with the difference between our English and Shakespeare's.)
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My protasis only said it would be easier than Latin, but as it is, it's still easier than most other languages. Every classical language except for Latin and Norse/OE will have a vocabulary just as foreign to English speakers as Hebrew. (The few Greek words you get for free barely make a dent.)
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His novels tend to have a King level of fluff and padding that could easy have been cut. If you enjoy that, then you're in luck. Aside from that, most people say that his short story collection 20th Century Ghosts is his best work.
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I'm having a hard time finding anything new and good in the genre Laird's Not a Speck of Light was somewhat decent, Ballingrud is somewhat decent, but I don't see anything good. Or read. Last new good thing I read was Occultation and it's been a while since that.
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What are some fantasy books where you feel the visceral physicality of the world you're immersed in? For example, I know it's counter-intuitive, but Conan stories feel like I'm imagining the events through the mists of history. Even though there's a lot of descriptions about Conan's bodily strength, it feels like he's not quite there. ASOIF is another one that tends more along these lines. The almost magical beauty of many of the houses makes it seem like the story takes place in a more ethereeal world, despite the violence. On the other hand, Second Apocalypse is very gritty feeling. I can almost smell Achamian. Another one is the Caine novels, where I don't think I've read a fantasy novel that's so visceral. It's not a dumb novel, it's pulpy but it's pretty smart, and there's moments like when a man's being tortured one room over from the POV character and it's more impactful and real despite torture being depicted in all the other stories I've mentioned.
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Malazan, especially in book 3 - memories of ice, made me feel disgust and claustrophobia in certain scenes. It’s an incredibly visual book that gave me sensory overload with how some things were described especially the house in Capustan with all the bodies, the tenescowri or toc the younger mutilation and torture with the insane dinosaur thing
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I'm interested in Elin, but it doesn't go on sale.
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Yeah that's kinda what's happening to me right now.
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Yes and I’m sure there’s stuff in the mega but otherwise even classical Mayan seems to have more posters than Hebrew. Probably because of it being particularly difficult and only useful to non-jews insofar as they want to get into Old Testament scholarship and want to be able to read the Masoeretic Text.
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Other Hebrew learner checking in. That's just not true. If not for the foreign vocabulary it would be easier than even Latin, and it's far easier than Arabic. Specifically about Ge'ez? Because otherwise, I'm looking for An Introduction to Classical Hebrew by Vance, if you happen to have that.
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Could you provide examples of Socrates waxing poetic and making logical leaps that the audience doesn't catch?
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Sorry for the chatGPT lad you brought it out of me. I can only talk about my memorys of the book in a general sense I don't have the energy to go through the book again just to respond to an internet post.
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Multiple generations of students are being taught that they need to communicate in the ugliest, most turgid critical theory-speak to be taken seriously / be seen as intelligent. How do we defeat critical theory?
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Probably stop granting student loans so people stop getting trained in it? IDK, why are you asking us this shit?
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Been saving this bad boy for Spooktober
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M.R. James is fantastic. I read his stories earlier this year and they are consistently great.
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I am an old millenial. But she as boomerrss is not fertile enough for my tastes. If she was a decade or two younger,:: I would go for it however. The dream/nightmare continues. She has dispelled me of every dogmatic analytic perspective I once held, by means of an almost dogmatic and analytic argumentation herself. Most recently, she demonstrated a proof for the possibility of bilocation as well as the existence of soul as a non-physical body of energetic fields using a secondary work on Ulrich called The Physics and Metaphysics of Transibstantiation. She also made cryptic references to my dreams recently several times, I can only suspect she is playing with my immortal soul at this point. I just cannot tell if I should become Catholic as per my forefathers or follow her down whatever horrifying yet fascinating strain of gnosticism it seems she is ultimately leading me up to. She claims that I remind her of her dead husband. She has a child a generation younger than I. Male. I am afraid I will meet him at some point.
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Did her husband die before you were born? If so, and if she was able to present a formal proof of reincarnation, then maybe you're the reincarnation of her husband
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Reading it in mandarin pronunciation is effectively doing the same thing. Reading it in reconstructed middle chinese is also effectively the same because we have no idea how far removed the original pronunciation was. At the very least I can tell you your method would be dramatically easier.
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This is sort of what the Japanese do, except more systematized, and also they still read some of the characters in their phonetic approximation of Middle Chinese. This specific line would be read as with 'sei' and 'zen' both being Chinese-derived but the rest being native Japonic. (Notably, they would also rearrange the word order, supply grammatical particles, etc.) Not really, reading it in Mandarin pronunciation is just reading it in the descendant pronunciations, like how if an English-speaker sees they'll probably by default read it as something like despite the fact that when it was written it would have sounded more like And as for reconstructed Middle Chinese- plenty of the most famous poetry was written by Middle Chinese speakers and made to rhyme and scan in Middle Chinese.
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It was the bussinest of times, it was the bugginest of times
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Not gonna lie, it was peak era AND flop era at the same time. People had giga-brain takes but also clown energy nonstop. Everyone was either full-send believing or hard-passing with “receipts or it didn’t happen.” The vibes were either main-character light or straight-up doomscroll darkness. Some folks were in their “hope-core spring” arc, others were stuck in “winter of no serotonin.” Lowkey we had everything unlocked, highkey we had zero. Half the squad thought they were speedrunning to Heaven, the rest were like, nah, express ticket downward. Basically, the whole timeline was giving same energy as rn, so much that the loudest blue-checks wouldn’t stop insisting it was like, top-tier extremes only.
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I intentionally stayed away from the show for the entire 5 month long journey it took me to finish WoT. It is absolutely baffling the people they cast. Its almost like they were casting the worst possible person for the characters on purpose. Min looks thirty and favors the leader of china. Aviendha is inexplicably light skinned with dreadlocs. blue eyed siuan is black with brown eyes. Nyneave and Egwene are people of color whom I cannot quite place without looking it up. perrin is black. They legitimately went out of their way to have characters that looked nothing like how they were described. Never watching that shitshow.
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Hey so what's happening with Scott Lynch? He put out the Locke Lamora short story in Grimdark Magazine and since then it's been radio silence on new Gentlemen Bastards stuff, what happened to those novellas?
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who is whitewashed
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ninaeve and perrin for exemple
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Multiple generations of students are being taught that they need to communicate in the ugliest, most turgid critical theory-speak to be taken seriously / be seen as intelligent. How do we defeat critical theory?
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Someone give this woman a nobel
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of course he is but the thread is about posting books mostly or entirely unspoken of on lit
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Mashallah her skin has pores
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Well, if you're American, you can call ICE and tell them that he's harbouring illegal immigrants. It doesn't matter if he's a citizen, he might get deported anyway.
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Ngl, boys, this sucks
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I believe you, but there’s an odd tendency among people who study Latin to treat it like it’s da hardest ever. Japanese grammar and lexical similarities to English are basically nonexistent. It’s far more alien in every way, and yet I’ve multiple times had people insist to me that Latin is harder.
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I think part of the difference is that you can watch kids' cartoons in Japanese and not in Latin. (You can also watch kids' cartoons in modern Hebrew, but it is a bit different from Biblical; I'm told it's on par with the difference between our English and Shakespeare's.)
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Why were you looking?
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I read his review Bataille's Story of the Eye and wanted to see what else he had to say-- behold, his shrivelled cock was all I heard.
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I am of the opinion that tourism should be banned for US citizens and people only enter or leave the country for diplomatic affairs, athletic competitions, archeological digs, etc. Recreational tourism should be banned and outside influence in US restricted.
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Is there any particular real reason you think this is a good idea, or is just because of an imaginary scenario in your head you invented?
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This is a good point. Schopenhauer has a tendency to come across as elitist but throughout his works you'll find multiple sources that produce an anti-elitist result. If you value money as the highest good. Material possessions are the highest good. You need a nation state to provide morals. You need the validation of others. You need a cause. If you remove all of these considerations you can still say Schopenhauer was elitist due to things like some people are profoundly good at music and art but the process of removing all the other considerations makes this ascetic and more of a paradox extraction than a glorification.
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Maybe you do
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OP didn't ask a question. He made a statement.
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You dont get it.
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Was William Faulkner the greatest American novelist? If not, who was?
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Melville
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Any good books with body horror? I recently read The Hellbound Heart (Clive Baker) and Annihilation (Jeff VanderMeer) and really enjoyed both.
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Once again, I am requesting books/stories with a heavy preponderance of skellies.
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This is a Red Rising general now with occasional bakkerfag screeching
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Why did Red Rising take over? Wasn't it some space opera published over a decade ago?
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He did it to mock Hegel
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You’re genuinely retarded. He did it because he thought clarity was important in philosophy, and hated Hegel because he thought he hid nonsensical ideas in obscure language. But keep parrotting whatever shit you’re fed from youtube videos, /lit/ memes, or wherever you get your information from.
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someone in the last thread called me "gross" for reading Stormlight Archives and ASOIAF there's nothing gross about ASOIAF, i've read the whole thing and it's great, but maybe Sanderson counts as gross? (i just started him, i don't mind reading slop as long as it has some autistic magic system for me to think about thoughever) i'm reading Mistborn and it's decently yummy for Sanderslop. my autistic trans friend recommended Sanderson to me
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and that didn't trip any alarm bells for you?
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There's a poem where he enumerates a bunch of boys he likes using their patronymic names. The TL comment at the end says that the poet "cast shame" on their fathers by doing this.
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A Games Workshop Modern Classic.
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